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secret_no_03

Nazis in 2019 and the increasing rhetoric on the left.

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The term gets thrown around a lot these days by what several people refer to as the Regressive Left, to the point that if you differ with them on anything or have any form of belief in free speech that you could be labeled a Nazi. if that weren't bad enough there's now a trend of videos cropping up asking for people to not "Normalize Nazis" which is ironic as when you label everyone a Nazi, it's bound to become normal. I don't think I need to go into a history lesson about the National Socialist German Workers' Party (Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei) and the rise of Hitler, post World War 1 Germany and the Great Depression being the catalyst and the Reichstag Fire being the real turning point to Hitler gaining power. There is no accurate way to figure out how many neo nazis there are these days because every outlet loves to lump the neo nazis in with the KKK and any hate group to make their numbers seem way bigger than they are. However, if the marches are any indication there can't be more than 800 nazis nationwide, if that, and obviously very few people run around in German officer uniforms or anything as such. Nazi sympathizers, skin heads and true fascists are as such, but they're not technically nazis, and neither is your neighbor because he voted for Trump. 😊

 

I think it's safe to say that nazi is just one of the buzzwords the left love to use these days alongside cis, white privilege and others.

 

With that being said, what's your definition of a Nazi in 2019?

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Come on dude do we really have to get into this shit again on MH of all places? A nazi IMO is just anyone who supports genocide and authoritarianism. Also anyone who believes in darwinism or race science will naturally be steered towards the same type of thinking a nazi would have. Also the jewish question conspiracy theory is a very popular one among the right. Also you're just plain fucking wrong.

https://www.jewishdatabank.org/databank/search-results/study/717

"The press release for the Study noted that an estimated 12 percent of Americans harbor deeply entrenched anti-Semitic attitudes, which marked a decline from the 15% reported in the Anti-Defamation League’s previous poll on anti-Semitic attitudes in 2011."

 

It's likely a lot higher than 12% in the post-trump America. That's 69 million people who more or less believe the same shit as the nazis did. Way more than the fucking 800 number. 

 

There's also this. https://www.huffpost.com/entry/reuters-poll-white-supremacist-views_n_59bc155fe4b02da0e141b3c8

Edited by lichtlune

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6 minutes ago, lichtlune said:

Come on dude do we really have to get into this again on MH of all places? A nazi IMO is just anyone who supports genocide and authoritarianism. Also anyone who believes in darwnism will naturally be steered towards the same type of thinking a nazi would have. Also the jewish question conspiracy theory is a very popular one among the right. Also you're just plane fucking wrong.

https://www.jewishdatabank.org/databank/search-results/study/717

"The press release for the Study noted that an estimated 12 percent of Americans harbor deeply entrenched anti-Semitic attitudes, which marked a decline from the 15% reported in the Anti-Defamation League’s previous poll on anti-Semitic attitudes in 2011."

 

It's likely a lot higher than 12% in the post-trump America. That's 69 million people who more or less believe the same shit as the nazis did. Way more than the fuck 800 number. 

I'm not wrong as anti-semites aren't technically nazis unless they belong to some sort of nazi organization. They're just sympathizers or wannabes or bigots. A person who hates jews isn't necessarily a nazi, but a nazi almost certainly hates jews. Being a racist does not equal being a nazi as the German nazi party also hated homosexuals and the disabled and killed them enmasse. Lumping all of these hate groups together just makes thing worse and helps explain why the term is thrown around so often. That would literally be like going around and calling anyone who's not a republican a communist, whether they're for capitalism, Marxism or what have you.

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20 minutes ago, lichtlune said:

Come on dude do we really have to get into this shit again on MH of all places? A nazi IMO is just anyone who supports genocide and authoritarianism. Also anyone who believes in darwinism or race science will naturally be steered towards the same type of thinking a nazi would have. Also the jewish question conspiracy theory is a very popular one among the right. Also you're just plain fucking wrong.

https://www.jewishdatabank.org/databank/search-results/study/717

"The press release for the Study noted that an estimated 12 percent of Americans harbor deeply entrenched anti-Semitic attitudes, which marked a decline from the 15% reported in the Anti-Defamation League’s previous poll on anti-Semitic attitudes in 2011."

 

It's likely a lot higher than 12% in the post-trump America. That's 69 million people who more or less believe the same shit as the nazis did. Way more than the fucking 800 number. 

 

There's also this. https://www.huffpost.com/entry/reuters-poll-white-supremacist-views_n_59bc155fe4b02da0e141b3c8

I'd be weary of anything huffpo as they're very left leaning and the anti defamation league and the southern poverty law center are downright nuts. 😥

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18 minutes ago, secret_no_03 said:

I'm not wrong as anti-semites aren't technically nazis unless they belong to some sort of nazi organization. They're just sympathizers or wannabes or bigots. A person who hates jews isn't necessarily a nazi, but a nazi almost certainly hates jews. Being a racist does not equal being a nazi as the German nazi party also hated homosexuals and the disabled and killed them enmasse. Lumping all of these hate groups together just makes thing worse and helps explain why the term is thrown around so often. That would literally be like going around and calling anyone who's not a republican a communist, whether they're for capitalism, Marxism or what have you.

Being a sympathizer is just as bad. Who gives a fuck if they 100% align with the same views or tactics of the nazi party you're missing the important part. The problem is they harbor the same or similar beliefs that eventually led to the genocide of the "others". Why would I be a regressive leftist if I treated a nazi sympathizer badly? 

 

"Being a racist does not equal being a nazi as the German nazi party also hated homosexuals and the disabled and killed them enmasse."

 

Who's more likely to be welcoming of homosexuals and the disabled? I'll give you a hint. It's not a trump supporter. 

 

"Lumping all of these hate groups together just makes thing worse and helps explain why the term is thrown around so often. "

 

I mean lumping a bunch of different types of people together and sending them to concentration camp is literally what the nazis did but ok. You know communists are some of the first people that got sent to concentration camps right? 

Edited by lichtlune

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8 minutes ago, secret_no_03 said:

I'd be weary of anything huffpo as they're very left leaning and the anti defamation league and the southern poverty law center are downright nuts. 😥

I mean I basically gave you another study that completely destroyed the idea that "Lol only 800 nazis in America".

 

Nazism is an idealogy. You don't have to be a hitler youth in the 1940s to believe in nazism.

 

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazism

 

At this point I would have to say that you definitely sympathize with people who might hold a lot of these same beliefs. Unknowingly or not. 

 

Can you stop making these leftist hit pieces on MH pls? 

Edited by lichtlune

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3 minutes ago, lichtlune said:

Being a sympathizer is just as bad. Who gives a fuck if they 100% align with the same views or tactics of the nazi party you're missing the important part. The problem is they harbor the same or similar beliefs that eventually led to the genocide of the "others".Why would I be a regressive leftist if I treated a nazi sympathizer badly? 

 

"Being a racist does not equal being a nazi as the German nazi party also hated homosexuals and the disabled and killed them enmasse."

 

Who's more likely to be welcoming of homosexuals and the disabled? I'll give you a hint. It's not a trump supporter. 

 

"Lumping all of these hate groups together just makes thing worse and helps explain why the term is thrown around so often. "

 

I mean lumping a bunch of different type of people together and sending them to concentration camp is literally what the nazis did but ok. You know communists are some of the first people that got sent to concentration camps right? 

1.Agreed that they're just as bad. 

2.Treat others the way you'd like to be treated if they're not doing you physical harm.

3.There are plenty gay and disabled republicans as well as people in the middle and this may shock you, but also plenty of people who voted twice for Obama.

4.Nice gas lighting with comparing lumping hate groups together figuratively with the literal murdering of millions.

5.What does communists have to do with anything other than what I said about the term being thrown around in the 50's at the height of the cold war to describe anyone who disagreed with you like people are doing the term nazis now.

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5 minutes ago, lichtlune said:

I mean I basically gave you another study that completely destroyed the idea that "Lol only 800 nazis in America".

 

Nazism is an idealogy. You don't have to be a hitler youth in the 1940s to believe in nazism.

 

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazism

 

At this point I would have to say that you definitely sympathize with people who might hold a lot of these same beliefs. Unknowingly or not. 

 

Can you stop making these leftist hit pieces on MH pls? 

This was literally asking for opinions on the term and what people consider a nazi in 2019. I didn't say "Nazis aren't real, my opinion is the only one that matters and all of the people worried about nazis are insane." I literally said "what's your definition?" 

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6 minutes ago, secret_no_03 said:

1.Agreed that they're just as bad. 

2.Treat others the way you'd like to be treated if they're not doing you physical harm.

3.There are plenty gay and disabled republicans as well as people in the middle and this may shock you, but also plenty of people who voted twice for Obama.

4.Nice gas lighting with comparing lumping hate groups together figuratively with the literal murdering of millions.

5.What does communists have to do with anything other than what I said about the term being thrown around in the 50's at the height of the cold war to describe anyone who disagreed with you like people are doing the term nazis now.

"Treat others like you'd like to be treated". Yeah no I'm not going to be nice to a nazi or their sympathizer. Take your dumb centrist take somewhere else. 

 

"here are plenty gay and disabled republicans as well as people in the middle and this may shock you" Don't give a fuck. Read what I said. Who's more likely to be welcoming of homosexuals and the disabled? left or right? 

 

Basically you said that you don't understand why people lump many hate groups together with nazis and I told you why. Because that's what the nazis did. They weren't just anti-semitic. 

 

Stop arguing in bad faith and keep this garbage away from the site. 

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2 minutes ago, lichtlune said:

"Treat others like you'd like to be treated". Yeah no I'm not going to be nice to a nazi or their sympathizer. Take your dumb centrist take somewhere else. 

 

"here are plenty gay and disabled republicans as well as people in the middle and this may shock you" Don't give a fuck. Read what I said. Who's more likely to be welcoming of homosexuals and the disabled? left or right? 

 

Basically you said that you don't understand why people lump many hate groups together with nazis and I told you why. Because that's what the nazis did. They weren't just anti-semitic. 

 

Stop arguing in bad faith and keep this garbage away from the site. 

I'll just say that the center is the best place for abject impartiality and where the majority of people, not just in America, but the world as a whole are. We can't ever hope to come together as a people until we look at each other as humans who deserve respect. Respecting and treating a person you disagree with doesn't make you weak, it makes you a good person, the better person and the more thoughtful person as two wrongs don't make a right. I'm sorry that you are feeling personally attacked and are worried that this place isn't going to be a "safe space" from ideals other than what you have, but exposure to people, ideas and beliefs we disagree with makes us stronger and wiser. The fact you get offended by any opposition to the left is just reflective on your own personal beliefs and experiences in life and there's nothing wrong with that. I don't care if you get upset as that's just an outburst of passion. 😊

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1 minute ago, secret_no_03 said:

I'll just say that the center is the best place for abject impartiality and where the majority of people, not just in America, but the world as a whole are. We can't ever hope to come together as a people until we look at each other as humans who deserve respect. Respecting and treating a person you disagree with doesn't make you weak, it makes you a good person, the better person and the more thoughtful person as two wrongs don't make a right. I'm sorry that you are feeling personally attacked and are worried that this place isn't going to be a "safe space" from ideals other than what you have, but exposure to people, ideas and beliefs we disagree with makes us stronger and wiser. The fact you get offended by any opposition to the left is just reflective on your own personal beliefs and experiences in life and there's nothing wrong with that. I don't care if you get upset as that's just an outburst of passion. 😊

Yeah you're absolutely a reactionary. I'm done with this conversation. 

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1 minute ago, lichtlune said:

Yeah you're absolutely a reactionary. I'm done with this conversation. 

You couldn't be further from the truth. Voted for Obama,

Former antifa

Worked with a Japanese antifa/anti-racist organization to form an offshoot of said anti-racist organization.

Support gun control and even abolishment of guns.

Support all abortion

Legalization of Marijuana nation wide.

Support gay marriage

gay adoption

police being required to wear body cameras and keep them on

abolishment of the death penalty

Prison reform

 

but have a good evening!

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5 minutes ago, secret_no_03 said:

You couldn't be further from the truth. Voted for Obama,

Former antifa

Worked with a Japanese antifa/anti-racist organization to form an offshoot of said anti-racist organization.

Support gun control and even abolishment of guns.

Support all abortion

Legalization of Marijuana nation wide.

Support gay marriage

gay adoption

police being required to wear body cameras and keep them on

abolishment of the death penalty

Prison reform

 

but have a good evening!

Okay Mr. "Nazis deserve our respect and have ideas worth considering". And yeah I would love for Monochrome Heaven a forum for Japanese rock be a safe space where I don't have to argue about nazis. I have the entire internet to do that. 

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The word "Nazi" (or Neo-Nazi) is—nowadays—used as an umbrella term for those whose morals and ideology align with those of Nazis during WWII, as well as those who idolize Nazis by using the symbolism associated with them, or otherwise. 

 

Free speech on either party is, of course, acceptable. However, I'm a firm believer in "If you want to spout your opinions publicly and/or violently, others should be allowed to react in whatever manner they see fit without [you] pouting and having a temper tantrum". 

 

"Technically" Nazis or not, they still share the same beliefs, mindset, morals, and ideology with Nazis of the past, and—thus—I find it fair for people to describe them as such.

 

Even more so, I'm a firm believer in this:

If you see any human life as being less than your own for any reason other than morals (or lack thereof), then you don't deserve my respect.

 

That's just my hot take though.

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