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Everyone has those opinions on music that either garner condescendent and judgemental sideeyes, or incites flame wars and shitstorms. I'm interested in learning what music opinions you all might have like that. Since popularity and unpopularity are relative and depends on the setting, please also provide a bit of context with your opinions!

 

Also, feel free to discuss the opions that others post! :3

 

 

 

As for my opinions:

 

"VK isn't all bad". "There's some good VK". Now to give you all a bit of context. These opinions are hardly controversial here on MH, but all of the music-heads I consult with outside of MH are adamant about their distaste for VK. Simply put, most of them hate it. So I usually refrain from mentioning anything VK-related in their presence, but IF I DO, I always find myself having to defend this opinion and go the extra mile to show them how credible VK can be.

 

"Dir en grey is still VK": Ok, technically they may not be considered VK and the band may not consider themselves VK anymore. Sure, they've changed their image and have shunned a few traditional VK aesthetics. Sure, they've added harsh, guttural vocals, changed the tuning on their guitars, and have taken on more organic song structures. However, their overall sound is still so battered and deep fried in VK, that it's nearly impossible for me to mentally segregate them from VK as a whole.

 

The fact that VK still has so many Kyo worshipping vocalists doesn't help either. Their influence on VK has been undeniable, so for me to regard them as something completely different now is pretty difficult.

 

 

I will return later when I think of some more. But for now, that's enough to kick this thread off. What are yours!!??

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I totally agree with your "Dir en grey is still VK" opinion lol.  I kinda can't help rolling my eyes when I run into fans who try to act like Diru is completely disconnected from VK and shouldn't even be mentioned in the same sentence.  Like you said, their sound is so rooted in VK that I can't separate the two. Bands in the same "sound profile" who were never VK sound different.

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I don't care about the visuals in VK:  I say this is an unpopular opinion because I've been told countless times that it's impossible not to care about the visuals and anyone that says that is lying and on and on.  But I don't and I never have. I have some kind of sick attraction to the music itself, but I don't give a flying fuck about the band's appearance and would prefer they didn't look so ridiculous if I had a choice, just so it'd be less embarrassing to point them out to people.

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Just look at Dir en grey's similar artists on Last.fm, all VK bands harharhar.

 

I mean come on, Sadie is a VK band correct? Rentrer en Soi was also a VK band right? Yet they all had vocal training from Kyo or give credit to Kyo personally working with their vocalist to hone their vocal technique. To say that Dir en grey has no connection to VK is hogwash. Just search bandmen blogs and you'll find a post here and there with Toshiya or Kaoru hanging out back stage at some tiny little VK dive gig.

 

Like I dunno, Kaoru and KISAKI chillin.

 

kaoru-n-kisaki-2007.jpg

 

So basically I agree that Dir en grey is still VK-ish. They certainly don't dress up anymore and are very casual but their connection to VK is still there, though more or less indirect.

 

__

 

My controversial opinion is that VK fans don't care about the music.

 

Okay, that statement is more of a joke but there's still some truth behind it. Just face it, most of us were drawn to VK because of how flashy and colorful it is. A lot of us were originally anime fans and VK is basically anime IRL almost. The guys are so colorful, so outrageous looking and are essentially a fantasy character. So it's easy to get into VK when anime was your gateway. That's why I think cosplaying bands, RPing as bandmen and writing fanfiction is so common because that's something that is done in the anime fandom. So seeing it among VK fans really doesn't surprise me and why I don't think it's a bad or weird thing either.

 

So basically when someone claims they don't care about the image at all, yet have entire Last.fm profile full of nothing but VK I call bullshit. There is absolutely no way you don't care about the looks. It's why almost all of us are here in the first.

 

And you know what? Who the fuck cares if that's what drew you in and is your main reason for sticking around. Trying to get on your high horse and claim you are better than everyone else because you don't masturbate to Kamijo every night is more obnoxious and worse than the girls that admit they get off every night to fanart picture of Kamijo molesting HIZAKI. 

 

Anyway, I'm in a hurry and on my phone. I don't think I really explained myself that clearly. I don't mean to say we all want to fuck bandmen but we're all still vane and pretentious so get over yourself and accept that you are just as superficial as the rest of the VK fandom. Deal with it.

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I agree with evilcoconut; I wanted to find heavy music and most of the Western stuff I found was so samey. I was attracted to VK because for the most part it's a unique form of rock/metal. I've honestly never really cared about the look of the bands I like :)

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I agree with the coconut,

 

as a musician, I appreciate the music more then what they look like. The fact that Hizaki passes off as a fairly hot chick means my dreams are already crushed.

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"VK music is going way too far from its roots" - first of all, VK music in general is not stemming solely from (glam) metal scene - plus some say X Japan "was the sole creator of vk style", which is truly false.

 

Yes, X Japan was perhaps "the first" act to be "the vk powerhouse in music markets" with their special looks, which later became a palatable factor for future MAINSTREAM vk acts - you'd have to look wild, cool, colorful and beautiful.

But they had a little to do with music (other than Hide's psychedelic creations).

Who's the main "IT" behind music then? As it was said years ago in a topic I cannot remember, there are other 3 bands in "the big four of visual kei" - COLOR, D'erlanger and Buck-Tick. COLOR's probably included due to Dynamite Tommy, who would later become pretty much a "big godfather of VK music marketing" with Free-Will/Firewall Div. policy etc.

 

Only D'erlanger and BT remain - both acts are tied to their pasts with sympathy towards post-punk/"goth-ish" music, which later granted those familiar "gloomy instrumentals and emotion-ridden vocals" you hear all the time in vk. OF COURSE, acts after them such as say, SADS (which might have invented "fashion kei" that Lycaon/Gazette cherish) or Baroque (which "invented" the signature elements of oshare kei music/looks) that had a little or nothing at all to do with post-punk fandom, BUT if you would exclude heavy post-punk influences out of VK roots, all you would get is a mixmash of power / nu metal /core and happily-ever-after-Canon rock, NOT "ultradeep dark music" most of you like.

 

Back to the topic - as I mentioned "the mixmash", it seems to have completely taken VK out of post-punk rails and "killed" the past sound, which unfortunately took our lovely scene to ultra-"American alternative" stanning - which after many thoughts, SICKENS ME. Yes, I might be accused of "sympathizing" towards these acts who actually sound like "American alternative" I talked about but hey - as long as it stays in LOW percentages of "alternative", I will be fine. Gazette for instance STILL has certain Luna Sea vibes to balance with cheesy Linkin Park/Slipknot riffage. Passable choice, briefly put.

 

You can get what I am saying just by comparing instrumentals. I would rather stand diminished chord raping than drop C chugging, which I have heard for like 1000x times. ALSO: if you don't know how to growl (looking at you, many neo-vk acts), then DON'T DO IT. Just sing FFS, and don't recycle chorus melodies from other bands!!!

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hmmn, ok i'm not sure if i miss the point here but i'll try anyways :P

the biggest argument or unpopular opinion i have with people around me is most of the time about perception and rating of music in general.
To give some context i'm usually branded as some doom-metal hardrock dude with also a knack for weird noise glitchcore drone-ambient whatever stuff. maybe rightfully so as this might make up for a slight majority of my music-library.

now people around me are all very much into very "true" and "real" music, like totally deep indie and super obscure electro and oh so dreamy post-hardcore aswell as the obvious trve metal, maybe for good measure even the occasional jazz or classical stuff thrown in to seem intelligent, without ever having actually listened to it.
the thing now is those all pretty much accept each other in a "i guess that's cool" kind of way, but for some reason as soon as Pop is involved everybody get super defensive, as if they'd feel their sexuality threatened. when i for example show some of them some K-Pop which i happen to really dig (some of it), i don't even get a response at all.  it's just raised eyebrows and maybe awkward laughter as to how supposedly riddiculous this is supposed to be.

 

now not liking whatever kind of music is totally fine, but you have to have some proper reason for it and explain to me for example why on the one hand jamiroquai is like the tightest shit to have come to the music world in years, but shinee or big bang on the other hand aren't even taken seriously.

this is usually when the argument about authenticity and "they don't even write their own music" and all that shit starts, which in terms of bigbang would even be false, and also is totally irrelevant to the music itself, i mean i don't hate on anthony hopkins for not write silence of the lambs himself now do i? then there's always a ton of other equally irrelevant arguments (only for teenage girls blabla, no real instruments blabla, gay blablabla) and all the other shit, which, and this is the point, the persons themselves actually don't really care about i believe.


for some weird and really unfortunate reason the progress romantically described as "developing ones taste" is just a long way of narrowing down ones horizon and the more narrow minded you are, the cooler you are seen by your friends. at some point you believe that shit even yourself and even tiny variations from that narrow road are enough to deem something shit or mainstream and sellout and whatnot.

it is an easy error to make, for myself if i am about to dislike something i always first try to ask myself why that is, and if that supposed reason is actually valid. a lot of the so called "guilty pleasures" should be enough of an indicator for hippocritical judgement :P.


people always shake their heads and tell me they find it weird that i (the "doom-metaller") think mariya carey's can't live or seals kiss from a rose is one of the coolest songs ever, I on the other hand find it weird that given the extremely limited space we have with what's considered music (12 semitones, more or less all in 4/4, more or less all consisting of drums-bass-keys/synth/guitars-vocals) force ourselves to like only even a fraction of that and even dictate that by outer influences like appearances and other connotations...

hmmn... i guess i went totally off rails here, didn't i?

regarding the Dir En Grey arguments here, probably agreeing with the general consensus of them still sounding deep-fried in VK, which is why i always find the "they sound like any other western Deathmetal/Metalcore Band now, SELLOUTS!" argument so utterly stupid...

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I agree with evilcoconut; I wanted to find heavy music and most of the Western stuff I found was so samey. I was attracted to VK because for the most part it's a unique form of rock/metal. I've honestly never really cared about the look of the bands I like :)

 

Yeah, my story is kinda similar. I was a nu-metal head back when it was ~cool~ and then the scene kinda died and I basically found the sound again in VK.  I've branched out since then, but the majority of VK I liked when I first got into it was all the nu-metal-aping shit.

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Wasnt Galneryus VK in the early days?

 

They weren't, although the metal crowd hated Syu's outfits lol which leads to my opinion:

 

Metal can't be Visual

  1. I really don't get this with the metal crowd, they hate anything none black clothing or outfit
  2. Something on the vkei side, except Versailles related artists, there is like no other great metal bands to look forwards to. The closest I found was VII Sense and they were just a hot mess imo

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E

 

 

As for my opinions:

 

"VK isn't all bad". "There's some good VK".

 

"Dir en grey is still VK"

 

so sorry for my rambling

 

1

there is some good visual kei! there is!!!  it's just that people even if they don't admit it .they care about image in the opposite way and they don't want to listen to a band who looks like an emo 15 year old in drag. it's so embarrassing and ugly for them they could never take it seriously.  image has opposite results for other audience . you have to realize the majority of the world find attractive the opposite of what vkei fangirls do.

damn my luck for  being a minority. it's hard lol /

although i find some of visual kei very ridiculous & embarrassing to show to others too (but amusing . ) and i wouldn't care if they stop visuals because at the end my most favorites are because of music. as much as i care for being attractive ,music and lyrics have the last word and make the difference and make me love a band.so both matters. looks and music.

and i think this goes for the majority of people even if they like different styles/ pop/mainstream people care too for looks. even metal/punk cares for being macho guy &having very specific style and everyone looking emo is disgusting.never to be listened

2)

deg is not vkei anymore but will always have the tag and should. because you can't delete your past. they used to be vkei

so the tag can be used always and forever.

in that i don't agree with people that consider visual kei as a sound genre at all. i think is only about image. sure most bands that play visual kei are nu metal/rock/alternative. and people confuse that with visual kei sound and think it is a genre. they way i see it if you are underground small band and play this kind of music you have better chances to succed in japan if you turn visual kei. it's clear for example when leda/deluhi  dressed visual kei was because he wrote music for  this genre-->rock/metal/alternative and it was the obvious choice to have bigger audience and do lives. it seems easier.

3)

i think some bands without fanservice and slutty clothes will drop their fans into half.

i don't believe 50% of people who say are only for the music .it's a big bullshit. if the members were ugly, those fans would go away first. not even care.

smart the bands who know how to sell image and understand what fangirls want when their music is mediocore become famous.

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I don't get why people get in your face about liking a particular band. Like some of you have said, my friends don't take VK seriously simply because it's Japanese (apparently only British and American music is really 'legit'...coincidently the same is true for films). This is pretty annoying as it's this narrow-mindedness which prevents me being able to share some great music. Their loss :)

However it also occurs amongst VK fans. A lot of people get all personal when others are into bands like The GazettE and it's just so pathetic. Let people listen to what they want; no one gives a shit if YOU don't like them!

In short, people should be more tolerant and respectful of others :3

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"I care about how the band members look" -  I guess this is more unpopular coming from the non-visual side of things . . . I'll be honest and admit that I do have a soft spot for guys I consider hot/cute/beautiful. I download all their pictures and follow their Facebook/Twitter accounts. I make up cutesy nicknames for them and perform all the other usual fangirl protocols (except probably fanfiction, unless I'm just being ironic), etc. 

 

Anyway, I'll probably come up with more later ~ . . . 

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"Old-school/90's VK wasn't really much better" With so many people parading around old-school superiority, I'd say I'm in the minority with this opinion. As someone who has been in VK for ~10 years and collects tons of old-school stuff, I can certainly say without a bit of doubt that there were a TON of really shitty bands back then. Anyone who would say otherwise is looking through some pretty rose-tinted glasses. That being said, I certainly do miss some of sub-scenes in VK that no longer exist(soft visual/white-kei/proto-oshare) and don't exactly like all of the "sounds" that bands tend to get grouped into nowadays, but I definitely can't say that one era was better or worse than the other as they all have their ups and downs.

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"Old-school/90's VK wasn't really much better" With so many people parading around old-school superiority, I'd say I'm in the minority with this opinion. As someone who has been in VK for ~10 years and collects tons of old-school stuff, I can certainly say without a bit of doubt that there were a TON of really shitty bands back then. Anyone who would say otherwise is looking through some pretty rose-tinted glasses. That being said, I certainly do miss some of sub-scenes in VK that no longer exist(soft visual/white-kei/proto-oshare) and don't exactly like all of the "sounds" that bands tend to get grouped into nowadays, but I definitely can't say that one era was better or worse than the other as they all have their ups and downs.

Haha that is undoubtedly one thing you see a lot among owld skewl fans.
 
I like old bands but I have enough sense to know that they're terrible and was an indie no name loser band that broke up after releasing their demo tape for a good reason. Now I like it though and I'll love it till the day I die but I'm not going to lie to myself or trap myself in a bubble thinking that old school VK was the be all end all of VK music.
 
A theory of mine is that, basically Goths love to bitch and moan about how true and gothic they are. I think a lot of old school fans are basically your traditional goth and are drawn to old school VK since it deals more with heavy gothic aesthetics. So combining old school VK with self conscious image centric goths you find yourself with the old school fans parading around that 90s VK was the best and most legit VK ever. 
 
However it also occurs amongst VK fans. A lot of people get all personal when others are into bands like The GazettE and it's just so pathetic. Let people listen to what they want; no one gives a shit if YOU don't like them!

 

In short, people should be more tolerant and respectful of others  :3

 

Oh jeez, especially among VK fans is the worse.

 

I don't care for Gazette but I have a friend who is incredibly sweet and an amazing person who fucking loves Gazette like no other. If I disliked her simply because she liked a band I'm not fond of, I would be a sad person and missing out on a wonderful friendship.

 

A good example is the Kamijo / Jupiter teams that are forming. Seriously people? It's okay if you don't like Jupiter but other people do or it's okay if people like Kamijo and you don't. Who cares, listen to what you want and TEAM JUPITER! FUCK YAAAL JUPITER 4 LYFE >:U

 

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I could only come up with one, so far:

 

EROS/erotic/slutty (whatever, you get it) Lycaon is so much better than old Lycaon: To me, when Lycaon started they were an okay band. They made somewhat nice songs, had a capable vocalist and so on, but wasn't overly interesting and ear/eye-catching for me - to be honest I lost interest right before their first full-length came out (to which I've only listened to once, to this day). Then the next thing I notice is swarms of people talking about them, so naturally I was curious to check them out again... and boy, did they change! :'D I just love the shamelessly and ridiculously over-the-top atmosphere their "erotic" style encapsulates, as well as the musical changes leaning towards sleazy SADS homages with the driving punky riffs and/or the slower cliché jazz/blues-inspired moments. I guess I might listen to them for the "shock factor" or that "it's so bad it's actually good", can't really say, but I sure as hell enjoy them more than their old style - it's just a whole lot more entertaining, overall. Sadly, they seem to be getting rid of these stylings based on their last terribly boring single. ;<

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em that's the point it's more about entertainment .
today's visual kei is more about who is the best entertainer and not who is the better musician/artist .

the one who has the most success is the best entertainer. not artist .

i mean entertainers have talend too and are needed but just know what is going on.

 

"Old-school/90's VK wasn't really much better" With so many people parading around old-school superiority, I'd say I'm in the minority with this opinion. As someone who has been in VK for ~10 years and collects tons of old-school stuff, I can certainly say without a bit of doubt that there were a TON of really shitty bands back then. Anyone who would say otherwise is looking through some pretty rose-tinted glasses. That being said, I certainly do miss some of sub-scenes in VK that no longer exist(soft visual/white-kei/proto-oshare) and don't exactly like all of the "sounds" that bands tend to get grouped into nowadays, but I definitely can't say that one era was better or worse than the other as they all have their ups and downs.

 

first of all i am a fan of new bands. saying that .
although i am not sure at all because i wasn't there lol.  it seems old school vk looks have different purpose than today's visual kei looks as ideology.
i mean maybe then it was more about looking disobedient or unconventional.
today is more about who is the most good looking or acting with sole emphasis on  profit  and not so much about the shock factor.
and that makes old bands have more artistic value.

what do you thing about it??

 

ok they were always crappy bands that coppy each other with same sound but of course the first bands were going to be be respected more just because they were the first/foundational? no matter how crappy.they started the scene.
people tend to have a feeling of respect of  their roots even if  themselves are better.because without them they wouldn't exist.
also most important some of them were pioneers and avant-garde and radical at that time .something that now is difficult to exist. i dare to say doesn't exist in visual kei now.

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about gazette. i don't hate the people. i am annoyed about the adolescence /weebo fangirlism these fandoms tend to have and the complete lack of interest and knowledge of other bands.  i can't follow them in tumblr etc and i don't want to talk to them because a majority tends to posts 231e342312321423 pages of how uruha touched aoi's shoulder ...from a distance... with his eyes... and OMFG the yaoi.

and another 33322909-0 pages of fangirlism that i don't care about because i don't find attractive the members. i don't see how i could talk with a person who only like gazette etc and haven't a clue at all about other small bands.or bands that i like. they tend to do that.

 

i mean NOT everyone.they are always exceptions. just saying a lot of people. i prefer lycaon fans etc for example even if i don't listen to them. they seem to know about more bands and have more interesting comments

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"There is objectively bad music (in a sense)" - I believe this to be a fairly controversial point to make, but only because people tend to miss the point I'm making, that there are factors that could label music as objectively bad from a composition point of view - it might be that they only rehash a certain chord progression to death, that they copy other bands in a manner that's so blatant and obvious that it makes it impossible to enjoy the music, simply put, the music they make doesn't bring anything even remotely fresh or innovative to the table. I believe that several of bands I consider to be good has some or several of these qualities though, so it doesn't neccessarily make them a bad band in someones opinion, just like I know of several bands with highly innovative and interesting styles that I personally find uninteresting because the music doesn't grab me, there's factors like personal preference in vocals etc. that can't be taken into account since there's no accurate way of measuring such things. Feel free to disagree with me if you want.

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It seems like that opinion isn't as unpopular as I thought but I hate VK bands playing Metal.

It's not even that I dislike Metal as a genre or influence but the fact that every band does it just destroys most things I like about VK.

It takes aways the simplicity and elegance of the genre.

The heavy chords eat up the prominent basslines.

The dark growls take away that 'vullnerable' feel many VK singers voices have.

The SPEED and SKILLZ factor kills the punky garageband-feeling and most of all:

The cheesiness and poseritis of visual kei bands isn't properly balanced by the bitter and 'unskilled' post-punk sound anymore.

Metal as a music genre is just as cheesy and poseurish as VK as a style and together it's too much pathos.

Almost like a fantasy RPG.

 

Also there are more than enough 'real' metal bands out there who do it properly and have singers that actually manage the screaming and growling, there is simply no need for so many VK bands suddenly trying it.

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i think you mean there are not enough old school visual kei in sound. most turn to neo rock/alternative/metal something that you don't like.

but that's too personal taste/opinion. i miss old deg sound too sometimes so i get it. but i like that "nu metal" stuff too.

 

my personal taste

i don't like pop rock bands like DIV  etc. that are the most succesful today. and alice nine type of bands.

vkei is full of these pop rock bands and are the most succesful.

i meam there are enough pop bands in maistream.we don't need underground and rock bands that are supposed to be unconventional ,to be completely maistream with  pop rock love ballads and cute looks.and that's why psc annoys me.

 

i mean these bands are more commercialized than pop bands. if i wanted pop mentality and sound i would listen to pop not them.

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i prefer lycaon fans etc for example even if i don't listen to them. they seem to know about more bands and have more interesting comments

 

That's quite a huge generalisation there. Not all GazettE fans are annoying and immature, and I'm pretty sure all Lycaon fans aren't as wonderful as you believe.

 

I'm not having a dig at you by the way, I just think that people should stop with the stereotyping already.

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i said there are exceptions though in a part you didn't quote. it's just that that i see more often  these type of fans in bands like gazette. lycaon was a random example because i don't listen to them. i mean generally people who listen to smaller bands.

 

i can not be friends with someone who only talks about gazette and 2 other similar bands. simple as that.

sadly i can't avoid stereotyping when the majority of fans i personaly meet tend to do the same.

of course there are exceptions

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